Wolfnman2000
Member
- First Name
- Ben
- Joined
- Apr 2, 2024
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- 2
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- 16
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- 16
- Location
- Martinez, GA
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- youtube.com
- Car(s)
- 2024 Integra Type S Performance Red Pearl
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- #1
Cherry Bomb got her second oil change at 3000 (first one at 991 miles). At the 991 mile change, I installed a Votex magnetic oil drain plug, as well as some neodymium magnets on the oil filter.
In this video I show what was on the drain plug and I cut open the oil filter to see if the magnets held any material to the side of the oil filter.
Purpose of the video was twofold.
1. Document in a visual way the amount of wear material generated during the first 3000 miles of a car's life. Keep in mind that the majority will occur during the first 500 miles, which I would have flushed much out during the first oil change at 991. So this is what occurred since then (plus whatever didn't completely flush out during the first change). Break-in oil changes between 500-1000 miles used to be in most owner's manuals. This was due to parts seating against each other, generating more wear material than at any other point in a car's life. Manufacturing techniques and machining have improved, but this process still occurs. There are plenty of examples of people conducting used oil analysis early in an engine's life on modern cars. You can watch as the wear metal content drops over time indicating the engine was breaking in and producing extra metal. There is much debate regarding if you should do a break-in oil change since the "engineers know best." The only thing I will say on that point is that automotive engineers are not building the best possible thing at all times in all cases. Nor are owner's manuals and service recommendations being made solely on what is the best mechanical answer for the life of a car. They are constrained by business realities. How people use cars over time, warranties, average time of ownership, government regulations, etc play into the calculations that car manufacturers use to decide on required and recommended maintenance items for cars. So here is some visual data for owners to look at and decide how to consume and how it applies to them.
2. Provide a visual for how much magnets may or may not affect magnetic wear metals in the oil. I have sent off for a Blackstone Labs analysis. I'm curious to see if the magnetic wear metals show up at all in the analysis or if they're at reduced rates uncommon to such a young engine mileage. Again, just providing data and information for consumption. Logically I would expect an abnormally low level of detected magnetic wear metals in the used oil analysis since they should have been caught by the magnets. Just curious by how much.
Why might someone want to use magnetic filtering, especially on cars with a reputation for seeing 300k+ miles without using magnets or special considerations?
1. The best oil filters are rated to filter particles to 99% at 20 microns. That's really small.
2. Engine wear WILL occur during the life of an engine. It can't be 100% avoided for a number of reasons. The wear metals (some fero magnetic and others not) will be circulated in the oil and if they rub against engine surfaces will cause additional wear to occur. This is one reason to drain your oil at shorter intervals. You don't want this stuff running around in the engine.
3. Clearances inside your engine can be as small .5 microns or less in some cases. So logically, since your filter only filters down to 99% at 20 microns (again in best case filters) you will have particles smaller than 20 microns that aren't filtered by the filter flowing around and possibly causing wear.
4. But not all materials are magnetic. True. Steel, iron, aluminum, copper, brass, and other metals are all used in various engines and transmissions in various parts. The magnetic ones, like steel or iron, tend to also be the harder ones. Copper is less able to cause damage to steel, for example. So by getting magnetic materials out of the oil, you should reduce wear even if you can't get softer, non magnetic particles out. Some is better than none, in theory.
5. Magnetic fields don't care about the micron size of the particle. While the filter may be able to get everything larger than 20 microns, the magnet "should" be able to get much of the smaller sized objects. Which is what we see in this video inside the oil filter. Many of the particles caught on the oil plug appeared much larger than those on the walls of the oil can.
So the question of if magnetic filtering is worth it comes up. Depends, in my non-expert opinion. I intend to own Cherry Bomb for 20+ years as my daily driver. That's roughly 200k miles based on my driving habits. Since long term reliability is important to me, anything that could help with that would seem to make sense for me. However, if you're a person who will own your car only inside warranty or the typical up to 2-5 years or under a lease, then you're less worried about long term impacts of oil change intervals or long term wear issues. So maybe not worth it to you.
Hopefully you find the video and this post of use when considering what type of owner you are and what makes sense to you.
In this video I show what was on the drain plug and I cut open the oil filter to see if the magnets held any material to the side of the oil filter.
Purpose of the video was twofold.
1. Document in a visual way the amount of wear material generated during the first 3000 miles of a car's life. Keep in mind that the majority will occur during the first 500 miles, which I would have flushed much out during the first oil change at 991. So this is what occurred since then (plus whatever didn't completely flush out during the first change). Break-in oil changes between 500-1000 miles used to be in most owner's manuals. This was due to parts seating against each other, generating more wear material than at any other point in a car's life. Manufacturing techniques and machining have improved, but this process still occurs. There are plenty of examples of people conducting used oil analysis early in an engine's life on modern cars. You can watch as the wear metal content drops over time indicating the engine was breaking in and producing extra metal. There is much debate regarding if you should do a break-in oil change since the "engineers know best." The only thing I will say on that point is that automotive engineers are not building the best possible thing at all times in all cases. Nor are owner's manuals and service recommendations being made solely on what is the best mechanical answer for the life of a car. They are constrained by business realities. How people use cars over time, warranties, average time of ownership, government regulations, etc play into the calculations that car manufacturers use to decide on required and recommended maintenance items for cars. So here is some visual data for owners to look at and decide how to consume and how it applies to them.
2. Provide a visual for how much magnets may or may not affect magnetic wear metals in the oil. I have sent off for a Blackstone Labs analysis. I'm curious to see if the magnetic wear metals show up at all in the analysis or if they're at reduced rates uncommon to such a young engine mileage. Again, just providing data and information for consumption. Logically I would expect an abnormally low level of detected magnetic wear metals in the used oil analysis since they should have been caught by the magnets. Just curious by how much.
Why might someone want to use magnetic filtering, especially on cars with a reputation for seeing 300k+ miles without using magnets or special considerations?
1. The best oil filters are rated to filter particles to 99% at 20 microns. That's really small.
2. Engine wear WILL occur during the life of an engine. It can't be 100% avoided for a number of reasons. The wear metals (some fero magnetic and others not) will be circulated in the oil and if they rub against engine surfaces will cause additional wear to occur. This is one reason to drain your oil at shorter intervals. You don't want this stuff running around in the engine.
3. Clearances inside your engine can be as small .5 microns or less in some cases. So logically, since your filter only filters down to 99% at 20 microns (again in best case filters) you will have particles smaller than 20 microns that aren't filtered by the filter flowing around and possibly causing wear.
4. But not all materials are magnetic. True. Steel, iron, aluminum, copper, brass, and other metals are all used in various engines and transmissions in various parts. The magnetic ones, like steel or iron, tend to also be the harder ones. Copper is less able to cause damage to steel, for example. So by getting magnetic materials out of the oil, you should reduce wear even if you can't get softer, non magnetic particles out. Some is better than none, in theory.
5. Magnetic fields don't care about the micron size of the particle. While the filter may be able to get everything larger than 20 microns, the magnet "should" be able to get much of the smaller sized objects. Which is what we see in this video inside the oil filter. Many of the particles caught on the oil plug appeared much larger than those on the walls of the oil can.
So the question of if magnetic filtering is worth it comes up. Depends, in my non-expert opinion. I intend to own Cherry Bomb for 20+ years as my daily driver. That's roughly 200k miles based on my driving habits. Since long term reliability is important to me, anything that could help with that would seem to make sense for me. However, if you're a person who will own your car only inside warranty or the typical up to 2-5 years or under a lease, then you're less worried about long term impacts of oil change intervals or long term wear issues. So maybe not worth it to you.
Hopefully you find the video and this post of use when considering what type of owner you are and what makes sense to you.
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