Soon to be New Owner of ITS - Question!

[Bandit_333]

Hi All,

I currently have a '23 M240i. Nice car and very fast, but I greatly miss driving a manual and also the M240i steering and brakes are very synthetic and lastly she's very heavy. Hence, I have been on a mission to find something like my old 330i ZHP optioned car that I had for 20 years before the M240i. I think I found it in the ITS. I test drove one recently. The steering, braking, burples and the most amazing shifting experience have captured me! The car feels so connected and the feedback is perfect. I don't care if its FWD. The LSD makes it a riot. With all that said, I am concerned to hear about the rattles that develop later. So my question:

Are the rattles more limited to early builds or pretty much all ITS cars have the rattles?

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[PRDE5]

after 3000 miles on mine, I haven’t noticed any rattles.

 

[NoelPR]

The car is noisy overall. Be prepared for that.

 

[nawfoo]

Every car rattles. Depends on what's in the glove box, glasses holder, maxed out bass, maxed out mids, maxed out treble, not giving it enough gas off the line.......

 

[Victorofhavoc]

There are definitely rattles. Some, like the infotainment screen rattle, depend on if the tsb was completed or not. No car is perfect and I've had a fair share of weird rattles in other cars, but this is the first new car where I've found easily preventable rattles in under 100 miles.

BMW is not without rattles. I've driven brand new m2, m3, x5, x7 and several generations back of the m3 and m5 and they have all had interior rattles. Their fit and finish inside is not quite at audi and merc level, but imo closer to vw. The acura is closer to Hyundai, Kia, Honda, tesla when it comes to interior. Exterior panels, the German brands just walk away in terms of gap sizing, lining up, and panel to panel contour. I'd rank merc at the top here, with audi, BMW, vw, lexus, Porsche coming in after. The acura has some weird fitment in places and again doesn't feel like it competes directly with that group. The acura is again in rivian, tesla, Ford, Chevy, Buick, Lincoln, and Hyundai territory.

That being said, a lot of it can be fixable and will take quite a few trips to the dealer. The paint is also way softer than the Germans, so ppf is almost a must and ceramic is a minimum. Don't ever let the dealer wash your car. It's two bucket system or bust. I've also heard on this forum that everyone else is stupendously lucky and received perfect cars that have zero issues. Maybe it's my local crappy chipsealed roads, but I have not been so lucky.

It came down to 3 cars for me... The ct5v black wing, g80 m3, and Integra type s. The blackwing was cool but too expensive on insurance, obnoxious to drive around town, way too much power for the street, and also a caddy. The g80 was fine, drove well, and sounded wicked, but the manual trans felt like an afterthought. It was fine to drive, but cup holders oddly got in the way, and the general experience felt special but lazy, disconnected, and ultimately a bit heavy. An e46 it is not. The its won out for me, and I'd choose it again in the same position.

Yes it's a linkage trans, yes the rev hang is bad and you have to relearn how to drive a manual by using immensely less throttle, yes the torque steer is very prominent, and yes the clutch is a numb little featherweight, but the rest of the bones of the car are good. The dynamics are solid, the chassis is pretty smooth, the suspension is way more compliant than expected, and since it's a Honda everything for it is DIRT CHEAP. Alcantara steering wheel can be had for 300$. I can buy 3 for the price of one in my vw or audi . It uses the old brembo m pads similar to 2002+ subaru sti so choices in material are nearly endless and cheap. The built in aero really does work. Same wheel fitment as some bmw, so wheel options are great too.

I'd buy it again.

If you're looking for a 330i zhp replacement, go build a time machine first or go buy a miata. If you're looking for a car that carries that e46 spirit in a modern electronics package, this is the car for you.

 

[Tw1stedlog1k]

7400 miles and no consistent, annoying rattles on mine. Built in March and took delivery in April of this year.

 

[Bandit_333]

There are definitely rattles. Some, like the infotainment screen rattle, depend on if the tsb was completed or not. No car is perfect and I've had a fair share of weird rattles in other cars, but this is the first new car where I've found easily preventable rattles in under 100 miles.

BMW is not without rattles. I've driven brand new m2, m3, x5, x7 and several generations back of the m3 and m5 and they have all had interior rattles. Their fit and finish inside is not quite at audi and merc level, but imo closer to vw. The acura is closer to Hyundai, Kia, Honda, tesla when it comes to interior. Exterior panels, the German brands just walk away in terms of gap sizing, lining up, and panel to panel contour. I'd rank merc at the top here, with audi, BMW, vw, lexus, Porsche coming in after. The acura has some weird fitment in places and again doesn't feel like it competes directly with that group. The acura is again in rivian, tesla, Ford, Chevy, Buick, Lincoln, and Hyundai territory.

That being said, a lot of it can be fixable and will take quite a few trips to the dealer. The paint is also way softer than the Germans, so ppf is almost a must and ceramic is a minimum. Don't ever let the dealer wash your car. It's two bucket system or bust. I've also heard on this forum that everyone else is stupendously lucky and received perfect cars that have zero issues. Maybe it's my local crappy chipsealed roads, but I have not been so lucky.

It came down to 3 cars for me... The ct5v black wing, g80 m3, and Integra type s. The blackwing was cool but too expensive on insurance, obnoxious to drive around town, way too much power for the street, and also a caddy. The g80 was fine, drove well, and sounded wicked, but the manual trans felt like an afterthought. It was fine to drive, but cup holders oddly got in the way, and the general experience felt special but lazy, disconnected, and ultimately a bit heavy. An e46 it is not. The its won out for me, and I'd choose it again in the same position.

Yes it's a linkage trans, yes the rev hang is bad and you have to relearn how to drive a manual by using immensely less throttle, yes the torque steer is very prominent, and yes the clutch is a numb little featherweight, but the rest of the bones of the car are good. The dynamics are solid, the chassis is pretty smooth, the suspension is way more compliant than expected, and since it's a Honda everything for it is DIRT CHEAP. Alcantara steering wheel can be had for 300$. I can buy 3 for the price of one in my vw or audi . It uses the old brembo m pads similar to 2002+ subaru sti so choices in material are nearly endless and cheap. The built in aero really does work. Same wheel fitment as some bmw, so wheel options are great too.

I'd buy it again.

If you're looking for a 330i zhp replacement, go build a time machine first or go buy a miata. If you're looking for a car that carries that e46 spirit in a modern electronics package, this is the car for you.

Appreciate the thoughtful response! Thanks! I understand fully ALL cars have minor annoyances. Nice to hear from everyone here!

 

[Blek le Roc]

Over 16,000 miles on mine and zero rattles.

For a while the tires were picking up gravel and throwing it up, causing it to occasionally get trapped between the brake rotor and shield, which results in a brief screeching noise, but after some wear they stopped doing that. (The winter tires never did that, only the OEM summer.)

Bottom line, no rattle issues at all for me.

 

[bvanlieu]

7K and chassis rattle free. My E90 went 200K, our E84 has a door/window rattle after 100K now I can't find so far.

Its a lighter car, so the way BMW doors close and other things, the Honda build is not as solid feeling but it feels great when you are behind the wheel and a few hundred lbs ligher then any modern bavarian.

The sun glass holder was my only odd noise as my frames could buzz a bit sometimes: little foam tape and all gone.

 

[optronix]

There are definitely rattles. Some, like the infotainment screen rattle, depend on if the tsb was completed or not. No car is perfect and I've had a fair share of weird rattles in other cars, but this is the first new car where I've found easily preventable rattles in under 100 miles.

BMW is not without rattles. I've driven brand new m2, m3, x5, x7 and several generations back of the m3 and m5 and they have all had interior rattles. Their fit and finish inside is not quite at audi and merc level, but imo closer to vw. The acura is closer to Hyundai, Kia, Honda, tesla when it comes to interior. Exterior panels, the German brands just walk away in terms of gap sizing, lining up, and panel to panel contour. I'd rank merc at the top here, with audi, BMW, vw, lexus, Porsche coming in after. The acura has some weird fitment in places and again doesn't feel like it competes directly with that group. The acura is again in rivian, tesla, Ford, Chevy, Buick, Lincoln, and Hyundai territory.

That being said, a lot of it can be fixable and will take quite a few trips to the dealer. The paint is also way softer than the Germans, so ppf is almost a must and ceramic is a minimum. Don't ever let the dealer wash your car. It's two bucket system or bust. I've also heard on this forum that everyone else is stupendously lucky and received perfect cars that have zero issues. Maybe it's my local crappy chipsealed roads, but I have not been so lucky.

It came down to 3 cars for me... The ct5v black wing, g80 m3, and Integra type s. The blackwing was cool but too expensive on insurance, obnoxious to drive around town, way too much power for the street, and also a caddy. The g80 was fine, drove well, and sounded wicked, but the manual trans felt like an afterthought. It was fine to drive, but cup holders oddly got in the way, and the general experience felt special but lazy, disconnected, and ultimately a bit heavy. An e46 it is not. The its won out for me, and I'd choose it again in the same position.

Yes it's a linkage trans, yes the rev hang is bad and you have to relearn how to drive a manual by using immensely less throttle, yes the torque steer is very prominent, and yes the clutch is a numb little featherweight, but the rest of the bones of the car are good. The dynamics are solid, the chassis is pretty smooth, the suspension is way more compliant than expected, and since it's a Honda everything for it is DIRT CHEAP. Alcantara steering wheel can be had for 300$. I can buy 3 for the price of one in my vw or audi . It uses the old brembo m pads similar to 2002+ subaru sti so choices in material are nearly endless and cheap. The built in aero really does work. Same wheel fitment as some bmw, so wheel options are great too.

I'd buy it again.

If you're looking for a 330i zhp replacement, go build a time machine first or go buy a miata. If you're looking for a car that carries that e46 spirit in a modern electronics package, this is the car for you.

Very well said. I do think you got a bit unlucky but the fact you still love the car is solid evidence that it's worth the praise heaped on it by the automotive media and happy owners.

I've had mine for almost EXACTLY one year, 7200 miles and am just as happy if not more than the day I picked it up. That statement alone for anyone familiar with my prior habits and car history is compelling evidence. I've had a wide variety of boosted and naturally aspirated vintage Japanese and domestic cars, BMW M, Audi RS, Porsche mid-engine and rear-engine; and the ITS works on so many levels while being literally half the cost of some of its competitors (and my previous cars). I don't like the word "special" because it's vague and overused, but as an oversimplification, what Honda/Acura has done with this car in its overall execution is indeed special.

That said, there are some compromises that if taken in a vacuum would be cause for concern. Mine has had some sort of noise since the first week of owning it. Interior rattles have come and gone like any car, noticeable but tolerable- the worst rattles I ever experienced were in Porsches- but there is the infamous "off throttle" noise that tons of people have noticed that truly does grate at my nerves. I've accepted it but all the excuses of "modern electronic wastegate", "lack of balance shafts", or whatever people try to claim is the cause of it doesn't makes sense to me, as I've already reference my past cars and never dealt with anything like this on any of them.

Interior road noise is significant, probably higher than a typical BMW, even M. But it's not as bad as a 911, I promise.

Overall fit and finish is nice but probably not on par with most BMWs- but honestly I'd put it at the same level as the F87 M2 (non-CS). My paint, panel fitment, etc. has been great but as others have noted that experience does not apply universally.

The stereo is not as good as the media makes it out to be. It's fine, just not a highlight of the car IMHO.

Changing to aftermarket wheels with just +15 offset compared to OEM (+45) did significantly alter the steering feel, in a negative way. More noticeable (but still easily manageable) torque steer, more "slippery" feeling at low speeds, if that makes sense. The margins for the "dual axis struts" that negates the torque steer is narrow, so just be aware that if you have plans to mod extensively, it will impact how good the car is as a road car.

That's about all I've got today. There's a whole thread about "things you don't like about the car" that I hate, because they can all be easily summed up in one post if you're a reasonable person. I don't think the silly things like lack of memory seat, sunroof, Homelink, etc. is even worth mentioning because they're not essential things to me in owning a car so there's no point even thinking about them. They're not available. If they're essential to you then don't buy this car. Point blank period.

I love this car, it's truly a forever car for me- unless they improve it in some way in the future.

 

[Bandit_333]

Very well said. I do think you got a bit unlucky but the fact you still love the car is solid evidence that it's worth the praise heaped on it by the automotive media and happy owners.

I've had mine for almost EXACTLY one year, 7200 miles and am just as happy if not more than the day I picked it up. That statement alone for anyone familiar with my prior habits and car history is compelling evidence. I've had a wide variety of boosted and naturally aspirated vintage Japanese and domestic cars, BMW M, Audi RS, Porsche mid-engine and rear-engine; and the ITS works on so many levels while being literally half the cost of some of its competitors (and my previous cars). I don't like the word "special" because it's vague and overused, but as an oversimplification, what Honda/Acura has done with this car in its overall execution is indeed special.

That said, there are some compromises that if taken in a vacuum would be cause for concern. Mine has had some sort of noise since the first week of owning it. Interior rattles have come and gone like any car, noticeable but tolerable- the worst rattles I ever experienced were in Porsches- but there is the infamous "off throttle" noise that tons of people have noticed that truly does grate at my nerves. I've accepted it but all the excuses of "modern electronic wastegate", "lack of balance shafts", or whatever people try to claim is the cause of it doesn't makes sense to me, as I've already reference my past cars and never dealt with anything like this on any of them.

Interior road noise is significant, probably higher than a typical BMW, even M. But it's not as bad as a 911, I promise.

Overall fit and finish is nice but probably not on par with most BMWs- but honestly I'd put it at the same level as the F87 M2 (non-CS). My paint, panel fitment, etc. has been great but as others have noted that experience does not apply universally.

The stereo is not as good as the media makes it out to be. It's fine, just not a highlight of the car IMHO.

Changing to aftermarket wheels with just +15 offset compared to OEM (+45) did significantly alter the steering feel, in a negative way. More noticeable (but still easily manageable) torque steer, more "slippery" feeling at low speeds, if that makes sense. The margins for the "dual axis struts" that negates the torque steer is narrow, so just be aware that if you have plans to mod extensively, it will impact how good the car is as a road car.

That's about all I've got today. There's a whole thread about "things you don't like about the car" that I hate, because they can all be easily summed up in one post if you're a reasonable person. I don't think the silly things like lack of memory seat, sunroof, Homelink, etc. is even worth mentioning because they're not essential things to me in owning a car so there's no point even thinking about them. They're not available. If they're essential to you then don't buy this car. Point blank period.

I love this car, it's truly a forever car for me- unless they improve it in some way in the future.

Thank you for sharing your experience. Very helpful!

 

[dockleryxk]

Very well said. I do think you got a bit unlucky but the fact you still love the car is solid evidence that it's worth the praise heaped on it by the automotive media and happy owners.

I've had mine for almost EXACTLY one year, 7200 miles and am just as happy if not more than the day I picked it up. That statement alone for anyone familiar with my prior habits and car history is compelling evidence. I've had a wide variety of boosted and naturally aspirated vintage Japanese and domestic cars, BMW M, Audi RS, Porsche mid-engine and rear-engine; and the ITS works on so many levels while being literally half the cost of some of its competitors (and my previous cars). I don't like the word "special" because it's vague and overused, but as an oversimplification, what Honda/Acura has done with this car in its overall execution is indeed special.

That said, there are some compromises that if taken in a vacuum would be cause for concern. Mine has had some sort of noise since the first week of owning it. Interior rattles have come and gone like any car, noticeable but tolerable- the worst rattles I ever experienced were in Porsches- but there is the infamous "off throttle" noise that tons of people have noticed that truly does grate at my nerves. I've accepted it but all the excuses of "modern electronic wastegate", "lack of balance shafts", or whatever people try to claim is the cause of it doesn't makes sense to me, as I've already reference my past cars and never dealt with anything like this on any of them.

Interior road noise is significant, probably higher than a typical BMW, even M. But it's not as bad as a 911, I promise.

Overall fit and finish is nice but probably not on par with most BMWs- but honestly I'd put it at the same level as the F87 M2 (non-CS). My paint, panel fitment, etc. has been great but as others have noted that experience does not apply universally.

The stereo is not as good as the media makes it out to be. It's fine, just not a highlight of the car IMHO.

Changing to aftermarket wheels with just +15 offset compared to OEM (+45) did significantly alter the steering feel, in a negative way. More noticeable (but still easily manageable) torque steer, more "slippery" feeling at low speeds, if that makes sense. The margins for the "dual axis struts" that negates the torque steer is narrow, so just be aware that if you have plans to mod extensively, it will impact how good the car is as a road car.

That's about all I've got today. There's a whole thread about "things you don't like about the car" that I hate, because they can all be easily summed up in one post if you're a reasonable person. I don't think the silly things like lack of memory seat, sunroof, Homelink, etc. is even worth mentioning because they're not essential things to me in owning a car so there's no point even thinking about them. They're not available. If they're essential to you then don't buy this car. Point blank period.

I love this car, it's truly a forever car for me- unless they improve it in some way in the future.

I hate to ask since it's so subjective, but do you mind elaborating on "slippery at low speeds?"

 

[Bandit_333]

I hate to ask since it's so subjective, but do you mind elaborating on "slippery at low speeds?"

From my test drive experience "slippery" is that the front tires can break loose easily depending on how you manage the clutch and accelerator. I chirped the front tires quite easily on my test drive without intending to do so. But, that was fine to me. Adds to the character of the car. It's a bit of a hoot to drive. Any that's just my guess as to what the poster was referring to by "slippery" - "tire slip" at start off depending on clutch and gas pedal modulation. Once the tires are "hooked" up the grip is amazing from my test drive experience and driver reviews on youtube.

 

[dockleryxk]

From my test drive experience "slippery" is that the front tires can break loose easily depending on how you manage the clutch and accelerator. I chirped the front tires quite easily on my test drive without intending to do so. But, that was fine to me. Adds to the character of the car. It's a bit of a hoot to drive. Any that's just my guess as to what the poster was referring to by "slippery" - "tire slip" at start off depending on clutch and gas pedal modulation. Once the tires are "hooked" up the grip is amazing from my test drive experience and driver reviews on youtube.

That makes sense. I'd say I tested out the slippage pretty thoroughly LOL

 

[Nivek2slick]

I'm at 12k miles and I'm just now hearing like rattles from panels I was thinking to fix it with like the stuff people use for subwoofers for dynamat also starting to get passenger window problems thT it won't go up it comes back down but all in all this is a damn bad ass car . I get compliments every where I go . It's fun and enjoyable and has lots of potential

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