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Integra Type S vs. Supra 3.0 as daily and track/weekend car

evanescent03

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Bottom line up front: any of you ITS owners ever driven a Supra 3.0 manual? What are your thoughts? The utility and size is kinda obvious so not worth discussing at length but i'd be interested in hearing thoughts on steering, pedal, shifter feel as well as power, chassis, etc.

I love my ITS but can't help my wandering eye (for cars, not women [in case my wife is reading this]). A local Toyota dealership has a nice white Supra 3.0 with 6 speed just off the truck, still needs PDI and I'm being tempted by it. Pretty slick looking car although some of the body panels don't appear to be well thought out or attractive. Overall, the Supra seems like it checks a lot of boxes for a fun daily and track-worthy car. I've seen quite a few being tuned for track duty which leads me to think they have some pretty good track support and hold up well out there.

Found this video from TheSmokingTire and seems like a nice summary at the end. It's a third car so i'm okay with it not being a year-round commuter. If it's my 'fun car" that occasionally gets tracked, i want it to be an upgrade to the ITS at least in SOME ways. Otherwise no point in making the trade.



appreciate any input from first hand experiences! of course, random thoughts also welcome from folks who haven't driven one/either

matt
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s219

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It's a fun car but has a lot of typical "isolation" you'd expect in a BMW platform, so it does not feel as sharp or edgy as the ITS. And the shifter isn't as good as the ITS. To me the worst part of the Supra was visiblity. It's very cramped inside and the sight lines suck.
 
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evanescent03

evanescent03

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It's a fun car but has a lot of typical "isolation" you'd expect in a BMW platform, so it does not feel as sharp or edgy as the ITS. And the shifter isn't as good as the ITS. To me the worst part of the Supra was visiblity. It's very cramped inside and the sight lines suck.
Supra looks tiny, not surprised to hear the visibility suffers but I’ve had Camaros and a C8 Z06 which all had poor visibility.

I’ll admit I did see the lightning lap for the Supra was better than the civic type r… makes me think I could hustle it around the track faster than an ITS. The shifter in the GR Corolla and 86 both felt a lot heavier than the ITS granted I was on a showroom floor and never drove either.

thanks for the input … thinking about asking for a test drive but don’t want to waste anyone’s time so soul searching to see if it’s something I may actually do…
 
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evanescent03

evanescent03

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so hard to "love the one you're with" isn't it? So many shiny new things out there.
so many. I went and put my name on the list for Z06/ZR1 after I left Toyota. Then I went to sit in an M4CSL ..those fixed buckets are no joke. Voodoo blue m2 looked spectacular they had also. Not enough time or money ….

I just need some warmer days so I can go rip on the ITS .. that should make me fall in over again
 

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Victorofhavoc

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I haven't driven the supra, but I've had two as students (both manual and dct). I rode along. The power is no comparison to the its... Not just the thrust, but the actual linearity of the engine and HOW it revs out is tremendously more exciting. Noise, no contest the straight 6 sounds better. Needs more exhaust though, and if you slap a loud one on it still sounds great. Interior quality, again no contest...its literally comparing a BMW coupe to a Honda civic. Lateral grip... It's a sports car vs econobox, the sports car packaging just offers more in terms of suspension design. The problem is factory alignment, just like the its.

I didn't handle the steering, but I did feel it was fairly direct and not quite as immediate as the its. I did feel the shifter and sent it through the gates...very bmw, so it was a bit rubbery and vague, but throws felt nice. My issue with the manual is gearing. It's close enough, but just doesn't seem so well lined up with the final drive. If it was a shorter final and taller gears, I think it would be a lot smoother in the mid rev range where you spend the most time. The dct seems well geared actually. As much as I wouldn't go back to another dual clutch, I would probably choose it in the supra over the manual.

Tldr, supra seems nicer as a "nice car" you take to the track. ITS is mechanically more connected, but not as "nice".
 

s219

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The shifter in the GR Corolla and 86 both felt a lot heavier than the ITS granted I was on a showroom floor and never drove either.
Can't really compare to other Toyotas since the Supra drivetrain is pure BMW, including the ZF manual transmission which has done duty in other BMW models. The shifter is maybe a little less rubbery than some BMW units, but still not like a Honda, Toyota, or Aisin unit in those Japanese cars.

The Supra is a very tail happy car, also a BMW characteristic. If you like to drift corners it is a lot of fun. It's an acquired taste in my opinion. My M2 Comp is like that too and it's fun up to a point. Vastly different than the characteristics of the ITS.
 

s219

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The dct seems well geared actually. As much as I wouldn't go back to another dual clutch, I would probably choose it in the supra over the manual.

Tldr, supra seems nicer as a "nice car" you take to the track. ITS is mechanically more connected, but not as "nice".
Believe it or not, the Supra has a traditional slushbox automatic, the ZF 8-spd. I've had it in a few cars (including my wife's current X3-M40i). I despise automatics but it's among the best I have ever driven and pairs well with the engines. BMW is even putting it in the M cars now. I'd have to lose my left leg before I'd consider an automatic sports car, but it would not be so bad in reality.
 

Victorofhavoc

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Believe it or not, the Supra has a traditional slushbox automatic, the ZF 8-spd. I've had it in a few cars (including my wife's current X3-M40i). I despise automatics but it's among the best I have ever driven and pairs well with the engines. BMW is even putting it in the M cars now. I'd have to lose my left leg before I'd consider an automatic sports car, but it would not be so bad in reality.
Good call! I forgot it's the zf!

But yeah, that zf is good. So good in fact it ranges in millions of vehicles, including some f250, Bentley, lambos, and so on.

Side note, it's in my q7 tow vehicle and when I had to back a 7200lb trailer up a 15-20% grade driveway and around a one lane 120* bend, I got the trans pretty hot. It gave me the most German warning in the world, "Warning! Transmission temperature high! Please adjust driving style!" 🤣
 

elh0102

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Comparing a RD sports car to a FD four door sedan is really a comparison of different market segments. The ITS offers the utility of a sedan, and it's one of the best handling of front drivers. That said, you can't make a FD car feel like RD. The weight balance and steering feel will give a significant advantage to the Supra. The FD car can't be tossed around like RD. Understeer will always be there to protect the uninitiated, but it also steals some of the fun. I had over 10 years on track with various RD sports cars. The ITS is a great car, but I would not consider it as a contender for regular track use, assuming the other options are RD sports cars. But if you are limited to one car, and you want some track experience, the ITS is certainly sufficiently competent to offer it.
 

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evanescent03

evanescent03

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Comparing a RD sports car to a FD four door sedan is really a comparison of different market segments.
True, but despite all of that, the driving experience in the ITS really is something special. RWD cars are generally more “fun” but I’d say the ITS beats a lot of those out in enough categories to still hold its own.

What I’d really like to do is keep the ITS and also get a fun RWD car. And a muscle car. And an autobahn cruiser wagon. lol.

I’ve heard good things about the Supra but always nice to put it in context which was the real point of this… thinly veiled as a “what should I do” haha.

I likely will do the more fiscally responsible thing and keep what I have … especially since we are building a house soon … but I’m a car-trading addict so this is what I do.

I may ask to test drive the Supra and they would make me feel better. Also when I get low balled on the ITS it would be a no brainer.
 

elh0102

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If you are interested in a RD sports car, take a look at a 2014/15 Porsche Cayman, the last of the flat 6 generation. It's guaranteed to make you smile!
 

s219

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Also worth considering the M2, since it's so much better as a daily driver than the Supra but similar handling and a smidge faster (plus far better brakes). The Supra is smaller and lighter, which is a big advantage for a sports car but it compromises the daily driver aspect quit a bit. I've come close to buying a Supra a couple times but I still have my 2020 M2 Comp, if that tells you anything.
 

FloArm

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I am incredibly close to trading my ITS in for a 2025 Java green m2. I too have a car ADHD problem where 2 years is usually my max. I find the ITS driving experience fantastic but since I use this as my daily and my commute is boring (1 hr in traffic), it is easy to get tired of the flaws that have been pointed out a million times. I really dislike the cost to “premium interior” ratio for the 98% of the time I’m in the car. The rattles, the passenger window that goes down when I pull the switch up, lack of heated steering, lack of garage door opener. But the 2 % that I get to open it up and get it on some fun roads, those annoyances go away. Unfortunately that doesn’t happen enough and I’d like a nicer interior while maintaining the fun factor. M2 kinda hits that spot nicely. Two issues though. One, losing the practicality as I have a 6 year old and 3 year old, but would survive with the m2 as I dailied a Gt350R. Second one is the financial blood bath I would take on the car since values have plummeted….

I must resist temptation!
 

nawfoo

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I had a flashed M240 and that thing would definitely gap any ITS. The Integra feels more balanced.
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